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Re: Th English are a cruel race
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Posted by: Nuno dos Santos on September 8, 1999
In Reply to: Re: Th English are a cruel race
Posted by AJ on January 24, 1999
Subject: Re: Th English are a cruel race

I agree with your a/ point. I could I not? Those are facts. But I cannot agree with the rest.
First of all, note that I am portuguese, so my opinion may not be completle objective, but here goes: You are being unfare on other colonial empires. Brutal? The spaniards did conquered the native american empires, but what did you expect? The reconquista left them a warmachine about to be dismantled the very year Colombus reached the New World. There was no premeditated genocide:disease rather than war made most victims and you cant blame the europeans for biological warfare (at least without blaming the natives of doing the same with sifilis.) And even the conquest was more the work of greedy private adventurers than the state´s. Let´s not forget that the two first vice-roys apointed by the spanish crown were murdered by the adventurers they were sent to control. Let´s not forget also that if you can point out an "hispanic" on a street in California today it is not because of any hispanic features, but because of native central-american features. And 40% of the population of today´s Peru still speaks quichua, the language of the quichuas, better known as incas. Can you find an apache or cheyene that easily in the mid-west?
As for Portugal, the reconquista finished 250 years before Columbus voyage and in between (1383-85) a merchant backed revolution replaced the dinasty and the old nobility. This left a bastard dinasty looking for prestige, an aristocracy of second sons looking for honor and pillage, and some very optimistic merchants looking for adventure. The portuguese discoveries were a national adventure, but this nation had only between 0.25 to 1.0 million souls. This meant that terror tactics on the East, slavery on the West active miscegination and nothing close to genocide were necessery.
As for France, do not forget that, despite being aristocratic and feudal, they always had the best record on achieving good agreements and cooperation with the indians on North America. Even after the revolution, the french were very sucessfull in transmiting their language to colonised people (if not so sucessfull in transmiting their form of government as the english) As for Germany and Italy they were newcomers, only arriving during the second part of colonial history, the period and etics being diferent. The first period being the pre-industrial revolution, trade, slavery, settlement colonies etc.., the second being the post-industrial, imperialist, resources exploitation colonies. At least their empires wheren´t that big nor lasted that long.(ps: the belgians where worse: belgian women flew home to give birth so their children would not be "africans")(double ps: I was born on Mozambique). The english were no better or worse than anyone else,... except for the only colonial empire ever to practice long term premeditated genocide of native populations: the imperial republic of the united states of america. Sad but true. Of course, if the other powers had had an influx of one million imigrants per year, who knows? This is History, there are no good guys or bad guys...there´s just guys (and girls)
As for the c/ statement I have to disagree: there´s no such thing as a pure race (there´s no such thing as race)but the english are no more mixture of races than others: Portuguese and spaniards:Phoenicians, romans, celtiberians, visigoths, sueves, alans, arabs, berberians; Germans:Alamani, Bavarians, romans, Wendes, slavs, Saxons, Frankish, suabians; French: frankish, romans, gauls, normans, burgundians; Italians: Romans, etruscans, greeks, ostrogoths, lombardians, normans, arabs, etc (also jews for all of the above). See what I mean? (how can some people be racists is beyond me!)
But as a portuguese seing some brasilian pseudo-intelectuals trying to blame colonial times for all that is wrong whit Brasil today, i can relate to you when you say:"The people who Britain 'oppressed' constantly deny their British blood - now that's cruel."

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